CAN YOU SEE IT NOW?
County Board Chair Scott McDonell, Supervisor Dave deFelice and William Greer from the Dane County Mental Health Center picketing Walm . . . I mean Woodman's. Loved the headline on this article. Do they look like protesters?
I STILL DON'T GET IT
Water bills going up $39.60 per year. No one bats and eye.
County board raises taxes by $38, people are laid off, social services are cut, sheriffs freak out, handwringing and political posturing grandstanding ensues. Would people have noticed if they had doubled all that and provided us the services we so desperately need in these economic times?
Ok, I probably do get it, but I hate to be that cynical.
SHERIFF'S ASSOCIATION TAKES ON . . .
The Cap Times, Kathleen Falk, Chair McDonell, Sheriff Mahoney . . . and makes it clear, there is no deal. It's "TENTATIVE"
I'M FRUSTRATED
Pat Schneider gets an F. She clearly didn't get it. I wasn't there, but I'm guessing that those same people who attended the vigil were trying to be respectful and not exploit the homeless to make a point. And, in fact, the people at this vigil are probably the ones that work every day with The Road Home providing shelter for the homeless or with their local Joining Forces for Families workers to make sure there is eviction prevention money available in the community. Or take up special collections to donate to local charities for eviction prevention. Or help fund Porchlight and Hasan's activities at the Hospitality House and in Sun Prairie. Or field the phone calls of people asking for help to pay their rent, or fill up the car with gas or help make up for a day they took off work for a sick child. This was a weak story. She should have talked to the folks and asked them what they do on a weekly basis. And, even if I'm wrong, and she's right. What's wrong with raising awareness and paying respects? And how could she just ignore the obvious thing she pointed out - that the homeless people had to stay in line to keep their spots in the shelter for the night. I suggest a do-over with a little effort to find out what people in this community do to try to prevent homelessness in the first place.
I really need to get a camera to carry with me, instead of using my camera phone. This photos is of a shopping cart full of a persons worldly possessions on the left and the lump you see in the darker area is a person lying on the inverted V shaped vents trying to get some sleep on Saturday night.
AND, THE EDGEWATER, CUZ, WELL, ITS JUST STILL THERE
Backwards Logic
I'm kinda shocked the mayor thought this was true. He said this about the delayed vote due to the snowstorm.
"If a council member is unsure, he or she is more likely to vote no simply because they're not sure. So I think if there's anything good to come of this extra week, they gained more information. They feel a little bit more sure of their vote and maybe that shades a little bit towards making me optimistic," said Cieslewicz.I think just the opposite was true. The more they looked at the law and studied the issues, the more informed they became, the clearer it was that they had to follow the law and it was too much of a stretch and the lack of real information, instead of glitz and glam, became clear. When Hammes and the Unions couldn't say how and what kind of many jobs, I think that they lost a few votes.
Speaking of Jobs
Pete Ostlind did some really rough numbers, to try to figure out the answer to the question about jobs. There are some guesses and the numbers are rough since he doesn't have any details, but they illustrate something pretty interesting, for what its worth.
The Mayor and others are now suggesting a 1000 jobs. If I remember correcting back in November during the budget hearings the number was 700. I'm not sure where the extra jobs might have come from.
I've done a little back of the envelope type calculations just to get some sense of what these numbers might mean. Its far from a perfect analysis but it puts some perspective on the numbers being thrown about.
1000 jobs
2080 work hours in a year
$75/ hr labor cost including benefits and overhead
2 year project duration
$93 million project cost
1000 x 2080 x 75 x 2 = 312 million
okay 1 year = 156 million
Let's try it another way;
93 million dollar cost
assume 50% labor 50% materials and equipment
93 / 2 / 75 / 2080 = 298 full time jobs for one year
okay 75% labor = 447 full time jobs for one year
but wait, according to the most recent TIF submittal (10/19/09)
total project cost 90 million
soft costs -12.8
acquisition costs - 7.5
= construction costs 69.7 million
50% labor 69.7 / 2 / 75 / 2080 = 223 full time jobs for one year
A project of this size is going to take at least two years to complete so the impact at any given time is significantly reduced.
I know this is not a perfect analysis but I'm having trouble coming anywhere close to 1000 jobs unless the jobs only last 3-4 months each. I also realize there are some additional jobs associated with materials, ie the truck driver who makes 6 deliveries but we're still far short of any of the suggested numbers. Which is why I'm curious if the trades have made any estimate.
How'd this become about Fred Mohs instead of the merits of the project
Cuz the Mayor and Bob Dunn keep making it about him. I can just hear the Mayor saying the headline of this article in that annoyed voice of his. I think their calculation was that he's a relatively unsympathetic character given his political leaning and, ha!, his money. That's what the Mayor does, when he can't win on the issues, he makes it about personalities. I know a little bit about that tactic. :) Anyways, Mike Ivey takes a stab at, who is Fred Mohs. It's worth reading. Love him or hate him, you can't blame him for being involved.
Oh, and for what it is worth, I don't know how this got attributed to me:
Mohs deserves credit for following what goes on, staying on top of the news and knowing which buttons to push.I didn't say it.
Interesting comparison
To the Overture . . . .
Stuart Levitan Explains the Landmarks Decision
Even tho he voted for the project . . .
When we will if there will be an appeal?
Today?
Who will decide?
It's an interesting political football. Schumacher was the first to clearly publicly throw it on the developers lap, seems Bruer joined in the chorus. I wonder why all the sudden finger pointing?
What does this mean for the future?
Well, with city leaders openly telecasting that developers and bankers should be wary . . . its not helping . . .

Brenda or Any Alder:
ReplyDelete1. On Nov. 10, 2009, the City (Gromacki, the TIF guy) provided a TIF financing hand-out to the Common Council in which he states (on page 3) that the total cost for the Edgewater project stands at $64.6 million (not $93 million, as Hammes and the Mayor contend).
Anyone want to explain this big cost difference?
2. In that same TIF hand-out, the City (Gromacki) shows (on page 5) that the tax increment payback by Hammes will range between $750,000 and $1 million for 6 to 7 years. However, as part of that rapid pay-back calculation, another $1.5 million a year is being paid back by some other unidentified entity (labeled as "Excess. Tax Incr.-TID").
Who is paying this additional $1.5 million a year? And, is this money that otherwise would be going into the general fund to reduce our taxes?
Thanks.
The document is here for those who want to follow along . . .
ReplyDeletehttp://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxlZGdld2F0ZXJ0aGVyZXN0b2Z0aGVzdG9yeTJ8Z3g6NGM3ZmQ2ZDczNzhhYTQ2YQ
I think you have to ask Dave and Hammes. The costs are clearly $64.6M. $46.6M in constructions costs and another $8M in soft costs. Financed by $31M in equity and $30M in mortgages. $16M in TIF goes for $3.5M in parking and $12.5M in public infrastructure (mostly to build the parking). I can't explain.
The "Excess" is likely TIF generated by the other properties in the district. Yes, that is money that could go to close the district to get the taxes for the general fund, or go to the schools or county.
Someone has got some explaining to do, if the City is planning on allowing Hammes to pay back only $6 million of the $16 million in TIF, as Gromacki's calculations seem to indicate.
ReplyDeleteThis would leave the taxpayers picking up the tab on the remaining $10 million by diverting that money from the general fund back to Hammes for its TIF pay-back.
The question, again: Who is paying the $1.5 million a year shown in Gromacki's TIF pay-back calculations?
Any of our elected officials want to weigh in -- Mayor Dave? Schumacher? Sanborn? Bruer? Bidar-Sielaff? Clear? Solomon? Cnare? . . . Anyone?
It's bugging me, it seems there is an explanation about where the other $30M is . . . and I can't remember, buhler?
ReplyDeleteRE: Number of jobs
ReplyDeleteBy Pete Ostlind's calculations above, if the project takes two years, about 112 full time construction jobs would be involved. Those 112 jobs would obviously end when the project is completed.
The 112 jobs number is at least comparable to a discussion at TDP Forum that started out by looking at the actual number of workers at the the $93 million Union South construction site.
If Edgewater is really only a $65 million project, not $93 million, one would expect the number of jobs to be even smaller.
I figured it out, its $65M + $16M in TIF. That makes it $81M.
ReplyDeleteI think you are right except $3.5 mil of TIF (gap)is in $64.6 mil hotel.
ReplyDeleteAdd $12.5 TIF "public" improvements to $64.6 = $77.1 million for total project.
So Hammes and mayor have been overstating size of project by $16 million.
What's $16 million between friends?